Welcome to Michelle is Money Hungry. I’m your host, Michelle Jackson, and I focus on holding financial conversations that lean into social equity policy and access with a splash of pop culture. My goal is to lead these conversations with empathy and help both my listeners and myself learn more about money. Along the way, my guests and I will focus on when American women decide that they want more in their lives. Interestingly, many of the conversations centered around going into entrepreneurship.
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With that in mind, though, I do want to say that my guest and I aren’t necessarily encouraging you to go into business. Instead, this conversation, in my mind, is a reflection of the policies that aren’t in place here in the United States. Policies such as paid parental leave, generous paid sick leave, or just having a degree of flexibility and autonomy over your days so that you can run an errand, schedule a doctor’s appointment, or take your kid to ballet, or sometimes you just have to help your parents out when things come up. I often wonder how different American life would be for women if we had some of these policies in place. Would the choices we make be different?
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Danielle-Thank you, Michelle, for having me back on the podcast. I am also a longtime avid listener, so super excited to talk today. I am the host of the Thought Card Podcast, an affordable luxury travel and personal finance podcast. I really just love empowering financially savvy travelers to travel more, pay off debt, and build wealth. So bringing money and travel together because they both go hand in hand and just honestly creating our own dream lifestyle. And then I do a lot of other projects. At this point, I have somewhere close to ten income streams, but I would say my other two major businesses. One is Grants for Creators, a biweekly newsletter where I curate different funding opportunities for creators and small business owners. And then woman of color podcasters. So I have my hands in a lot of different pots, but at the end of the day, you can come to me for podcasting, travel and money.
Michelle-I wanted to talk about before we got really deep into this conversation, I wanted to talk about women of color podcasters and kind of share why I love being a member, but also why I think being a woman of color who has a podcast is so important. So for those of you who are joining us, Danielle has this wonderful community called Woke Podcasters or Woman of Color Podcasters. And I am a paying member of this community and I’m happy to do it. And it has been wonderful discovering all the unique and amazing creative content and impactful work that other women across the world, quite frankly, are creating and producing. But when I think of women of color and podcasts, I think of those moments in my life where I’ve been silenced because people don’t want to hear what I have to say, right? It’s happened at work. It happened when I was in second grade, probably because I was talking at the wrong time. But I’m going to share this story.
Danielle-Right? Yeah. That is such a touching story and speaks to me personally on so many different levels. And also I’m just going to add on top of that because I think finding a community such as one of the color podcasters is so important to me because it’s very isolating. Podcasting is very isolating still today. If you go on the top 100 podcasts on Apple podcasts, there’s going to be a select few, which we all typically know who they are, who are charting the charts. And it’s really easy to think and believe that women of color are not podcasting, that they’re not sharing their stories, their expertise and knowledge in the audio medium. And that’s why our organization is created for is to really be like, no, we do exist. We are here and we’re also very strategic. We are using our podcast to create businesses, create wealth for ourselves, to share ideas, share stories, to be artistic and creative, all these things. So I really think it’s important to not only be in community with each other, but also learn and contribute to the medium as well.
Michelle-You recently, about a year ago, decided to become a full time entrepreneur. I find your story so interesting because you have a family, you have a little he’s adorable. I feel like sometimes navigating entrepreneurship as a parent because you’ve got a small human that has to be taken care of is a little different than as a person without other dependents. What was it like for you to work through the process of deciding to move forward with that? And why did you do it? 2.4s Like your previous role was very impactful for you, that you enjoyed it. So I’m curious as to why you decided to redefine how work would be for you.
Danielle-Yes. So previously I was a grant manager. I loved my job. I worked with faculty, researchers, physicians on submitting grant applications. That was my thing. I was extremely good at it and also was very, very independent job and I could boss them around, which is like, really fun. Me bossing doctors around and being like, these things are due and we’re going to submit this grant. So I really loved it. But on the side, I was also writing about travel and personal finance. I was also podcasting as well. And a part of me inside of me longed to do this full time. And behind the scenes, I was also commuting about 2 hours one way to New York City every single day for years. And I was able to negotiate eventually sometime, being able to work remotely, but I was just like, I really can’t go back to this time suck. And no matter how I justify it, I just didn’t want to go back to that. So my husband actually came to me in one day and he’s like, you know, you had these big dreams of going full time. Why don’t you take a challenge and take this time to just try to see how much you can bring in and see if going full time could be something that’s possible? And I was like, babe, are you sure? I was like, you know what? I’ll take you up on the challenge. So my goal was to save about three months worth of my salary just so that I can see, okay, if I can go full time and. I saved three months of my salary, and I kept going and going and going…
Michelle-But I’m going to say something that’s unusual, that you had that benefit. By the way, most people don’t have that benefit.
Danielle-Yeah. I literally walked away from 520 hours because I just never took sick time. Never, ever. Which I highly do not recommend that I wish I would have. But for whatever reason, all the reasons why we feel like we can’t take our sick time away. And I lost all that time when I decided I wasn’t going to. 1s They didn’t pay me out. No. So I lost 520 hours of sick time that I could have cashed out. But unfortunately, the policy was designed that way. But at the time, I was just ready to leave. I felt comfortable and confident in my ability. I had savings based off of my income from my side hustle to depend on if, for whatever reason, I had to pull from that fund. So it was a really tough decision to make, but at the end of the day, I chose me, and it’s been the best decision. I was tweeting out the other day. I had always had these dreams of being a stay at home mom.
Danielle-And it never felt or seemed possible. My mom was a single mom. She worked really hard and because of being the single status, like, she was away from the home all the time and I didn’t want to raise my son in that way. So looking back at it and being like, wow, all that hard work, all those seven years of side hustling and working, giving 100% to my job and also 100% to my son eye hustle means that I can be with my son in the middle of the day. I can do these things. So that’s a bit of my story and the roundabout way of how it all transpired over the last year and a half.
Michelle-I didn’t plan on asking this question, but I am curious. You are a multi passionate entrepreneur. You have multiple things that you’re working on. For those women who are listening to the show who are also multi passionate, what’s the advice that you would give to them to nurture the different passions and get them to actually make money? While this is not an entrepreneurship episode, in terms of teaching entrepreneurship, I do think that there are probably some people who are like, you have ten revenue streams. Like, how are you making this happen? And I think that if you have a couple of quick tips to share, that would be so welcome by the listeners.
Danielle-Of course, I realized that there’s a difference between the projects and skills that I have that make me money and the project consults that I have that are not as lucrative, but I enjoy them. So I’ve had to make the hard decisions to be like I’m going to be prioritizing on the items that are making me money that’s enjoyable, but that are profitable. So I try to focus on at least two active income streams at one time and those become my main focus. So day in and day out, I’m working on building those active income streams. And then the secondary, the secondary tier is filling it with semi passive income streams, meaning that I do work now that could potentially pay off later.
Michelle-I love that. Why do you think women, in particular, women of color, are being drawn towards entrepreneurship in record numbers? African American women in particular are going into entrepreneurship at, like, I think the rate is 300% over the next group below them. So what do you think is attracting people to entrepreneurship? Again, we’re talking about designing your best life, but what is it that you think women feel will happen for them as they go into entrepreneurship? What are your thoughts about just traditional nine to five and how that impacts the dreams that we have for ourselves? And by the way, listeners, neither one of us are anti-nine to five. I loved my old job until I didn’t, and I worked it for ten years. I absolutely loved it. I went hiking, stuff like that. But I do think that there is a moment where there are moments in your professional life where you do have these questions. So I’m curious, what are your thoughts on why we’re moving into entrepreneurship at the rates that we are and what isn’t? What needs aren’t being met?
Danielle-Yes. So I think that because of the need in today’s world to have multiple income streams that it actually makes a lot of sense to start as a side hustle and just try things out, whether that’s developing an app or freelancing or doing other side hustles and odd jobs like that. Think there’s a financial need out there to bring in more income and bringing a diverse array of income. So that probably opens up the door to pursuing entrepreneurship. I also think that a lot of women of color, if they were from immigrants, like an immigrant household and their family immigrated to the United States, they maybe saw their parents having multiple jobs. And back then it was multiple jobs. It wasn’t a side hustle. It was like, no, my grandma and my aunt has two jobs.
Michelle-One of the conversations that I’ve had with people about their jobs and what they get from work is people love when they are acknowledged for the work that they do, or they get professional accolades such as awards and so on and so forth, or the ability to participate in unique programs specific to their job. So, for example, when I was working at the university, towards the end of my time there, my director put my name down for a professional development program that the university had. So I think every year they would have 25 professionals participate in this year long professional development experience, which it was a wonderful experience, by the way, and it was definitely helpful to keep me there a little longer. But I think when we think of entrepreneurship, there’s this idea that those kinds of accolades and opportunities don’t exist. Could you talk about how your professional experience has been in terms of those types of opportunities?
Danielle-It’s sort of like your love language, right? So how do you thrive when you’re feeling appreciated? So when I think about that in my nine to five setting, it was getting promotions, getting raises, but also it was the small things. Like after we submitted a grant that I was a lead on, my investigator coming to me and thanking me personally or giving me some flowers, that bonus check at the end of the year. So those are the things that made me feel appreciated and valued. Also, getting a promotion every couple of years too, definitely did help. And so that was that when it came to nine to five job. Now as an entrepreneur, tiy don’t have that in that sense. But my love language is still the same where when I deliver on a podcast campaign and the sponsor comes back to me, my brand comes back to me and they’re amazed and they are actually going to go and put that episode on their home page or on their website, that is an appreciation.
Michelle-I’m going to talk about something that I actually discussed in an interview that I did yesterday. And I think it’s incredibly important in that I’m speaking with primarily American women about designing their best lives. But one of the things that is definitely a roadblock is insurance. And given that you’re a new mom and you turned in your notice and then you’re like, oh God, I’m bright, could you kind of talk about that part of your journey and what happened? I’m not sure that I know that part of your story. So, Michelle’s Money Hungry is a podcast that touches on a lot of topics around policy in social good and equity. And I’m wanting you to share your thoughts on what and this is kind of a hard question, but what are some policies that you think the United States. Could pass that don’t seem to exist now that could help women have better lives. This is very broad. You might share something that I have no idea, I never thought about. And this would be policy whether you are a mom or not, to make (the question) it even tougher.
Danielle-Yes. This is an interesting question. One of the things that we have in the state of Connecticut is paid family leave, which we found to be actually really helpful for us when both my husband and I wanted to take time off and be with our son. So I’d love to see that across the board where regardless of if you have a job where you pay into this fund or you don’t pay into this fund, that we can all be there with our newborns without having to feel stressed about our finances. At least a percentage of our finances will be covered with that. And having that really allowed us to not have to worry as much. Because when I was giving birth, I was actually in the hospital for a few weeks where we had no income, we had nothing going on. It was just bedridden immediately. And my husband were just in bed all day. And knowing that that fund was there was really just comforting for us. But I can only imagine the thousands of families that don’t have that financial comfort and financial security. So I’d definitely love to see to see that for sure.
Michelle-You actually brought up something that I’d forgotten had passed here in Colorado, and we will have a paid family leave as well as for single entrepreneurs, actually. And that law goes into effect in January of 2024. So one more year to go as they get it all figured out and fleshed out. I would 100% agree with you. I often will be in the social media streets reminding people that a lot of times recently, there was this whole thing about, well, why don’t Americans travel? I’m like, we don’t have paid time off.
Danielle-The best place to reach out to me would be over@danielldazier.com. From there you’ll find all my projects, but check out my podcast, the Thought Card Podcast, all about travel and personal finance. I’m also really active on Twitter at the thought card on Twitter. So I would love to connect with you.
WOC Podcasters
I’m so happy to be a paying member of Women Of Color Podcasters a community created by Danielle Desir of The Thoughtcard, a personal finance and affordable travel website and podcast. Women of Color Podcasters is the home base that I go to hang out with other creatives designing content that I’m so excited about. I love participating in the different workshops offered, strategy sessions and learning about all of the cool shows that these amazing creatives are producing. If you’re looking for professional support and community-Women of Color Podcasters is the community that I belong to. Thank you to Danielle and WOC Podcasters for being a supporter of my show and helping me to bring this episode to life as a sponsor. If you would like to learn more about WOC Podcasters, go to https://michelleismoneyhungry.com/woc for more information.
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